Chris Stein is the co-founder and guitarist and songwriter for the band Blondie. Chris talks about growing up in Brooklyn, school, trips to San Francisco, Andy Warhol and drugs, as well as Blondie’s career. Listen to an intellectual tell the story of the New York scene.

https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/9ff4fb19-54d4-41ae-ae7a-8a6f8d3dafa8/episodes/14157059-34dc-4de3-a6ac-d5c5028f1f78/the-bob-lefsetz-podcast-chris-stein

https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-bob-lefsetz-podcast/episode/chris-stein-202365793

People have too much money.

This is what happens when belief in the American Dream runs amok.

The American Dream is dead, statistically your odds of moving up the economic food chain are higher in Europe than they are in the United States. But a disinformation campaign by the rich, those in control of our country, has kept the dream alive so the underclasses won’t revolt. So you hope you can make it, you believe you can make it, and if you work that hard to make it you don’t want to be taxed. But the end result is you don’t make it and those with wealth, often continuing through generations, keep it.

But it gets worse. A lot of the rich are tied to multinational companies, and as a result don’t pay the low taxes they should, i.e. they hide their revenue abroad. Ever hear of the Panama Papers? Read Bill Browder’s new book, the Russian oligarchs moved all their money to “neutral” Switzerland. But it’s not only Switzerland, it’s Cyprus and the Bahamas and… If you’ve got a lot of money you can afford to come up with schemes to avoid taxes, parking your cash in places where it oftentimes can’t be found, and if it is your army of lawyers will keep the government at bay possibly indefinitely. Even U2 takes advantage of tax schemes, parking their money in the Netherlands. You don’t want to give back to Ireland, the country that bred and supported you, made you who you are.

There’s a fiction that the rich make this money independently. This could not be further from the truth. If people stop buying Teslas, Elon Musk’s fortune rapidly decreases. And SpaceX is supported by the government and the companies which employ it to launch satellites.

But it gets even worse. Musk thinks he’s more powerful than the government, that he’s immune. Yes, he was supposed to file with the SEC when he purchased a certain amount of Twitter stock but he didn’t. He has a long history of making deals with the government and then breaking them and/or asking for relief.

As for Twitter… Sure, every company can be improved. But do we really want one guy in charge of an enterprise deciding what to do? it’s one thing if you built the company, it’s quite another if you go around buying and changing companies on a whim, because you’re so damn rich.

Best/worst example being Peter Thiel and Gawker. He put the company out of business because it outed him as gay. Thiel did it by funding Hulk Hogan’s lawsuit. When you’re a billionaire there’s more than one way to skin a cat.

And when it comes to the government… It’s controlled by the rich. Because they are the ones with money. There was a big exposé of this in the paper recently but people don’t know it, they’re too busy worrying about hip-hop beefs and enjoying rooting for the team on Fox News. They don’t want you to know the truth, you might get angry, you might revolt.

Rupert Murdoch, an Australian citizen, comes to the U.S. becomes an American citizen and lobbies for the rule limiting TV station ownership to be changed. You don’t even have any change in your pocket!

They keep saying it can’t happen here. But Trump evidences that authoritarianism is at our doorstep. It can happen here, and it seems to be happening, look at the changes in voting laws, never mind the evisceration of abortion rights.

It all comes down to money. Fat cats. Not only the Kochs, but hedge fund money too. The names are out there, but they rarely get traction. The biggest scapegoat is George Soros while Elon Musk takes action in plain sight and gets away with it.

I don’t want to live in a country where billionaires can change the course of history on a whim.

I don’t want to live in a country where you can work for an established company and make fifty or a hundred million a year or more. It’s one thing if you start it, but why should you get paid this kind of cash if you’re just managing it? There are a zillion offenders, even Tim Apple. Cook is running what Jobs built, the true innovation is in the rearview mirror, but when his tenure at Apple is done he’ll be a billionaire. And Cook’s name is one you know, there are many more which you don’t.

And it’s an insiders club. They sit on each others boards and grant these paydays and they lobby the government to approve their behavior. As for the government, the financial industry crashes the government and they don’t get penalized, they get rewarded! They’re given money to keep the country afloat. No one goes to jail, no one pays a price, which has these wankers believing they’re immune. Which to a great degree they are, unlike you.

And you are whipsawed by their whims.

And then there’s the b.s. that the poor don’t pay taxes. They may not pay income taxes, but they’re paying a slew of taxes every day, and they have to spend all of their income to stay alive, whereas the rich do not.

So Putin is waging a war against Ukraine nearly with impunity. It’s on the front page of every newspaper, it’s on cable TV, but it’s remote, you’re focused on what’s in front of your face and there’s nothing you, or to a great deal anybody, can do about it. Everybody’s afraid of causing a nuclear conflagration. So Putin’s troops commit war crimes, what happened in Bucha is horrifying, but the experts believe he will skate.

And they cracked down on the Russian oligarchs. Who might have stolen their assets, Putin being complicit, but somehow the rest of the world’s oligarchs are immune. They’re buying big yachts, they’re flaunting their wealth, they’re nearly untouchable.

Musk is a madman. Intelligent, yes. Responsible for successes, yes. But look at the actions in his personal life. The multiple marriages, the multiple kids. The statements on Twitter. Is this who we want in charge?

OF COURSE NOT!

And his goal is free speech on Twitter… I.e. no penalties for himself and the allowance of disinformation on the site, like allowing Trump back on. We need guardrails in society. We need limits. We need laws. We can’t have free-for-alls.

This has got to stop.

But it won’t. Because these same people are in control and don’t want to give up power. Talk to anybody with a buck and they’ll say they need to pay fewer taxes, that they earned the money and they deserve to keep it and the government wastes it. Well, once again, they didn’t earn it in a vacuum. And if you think you want to live in a country without laws…,you don’t. You like the laws, you like to be protected, you like having the police.

But they can’t even nail Trump, Congress is afraid of the backlash and in New York City the new DA whittled down the case and those responsible for the prosecution left their jobs. It’s always the same, the people invading the Capitol on 1/6…they’re going to jail, thank god, but the big people, those in charge, they’re getting away scot-free. Just like Wall Street in 2008.

People will wake up. When it’s too late. When their freedom is compromised. It’s like boiling a lobster, you don’t realize you’re being cooked until it’s too late.

Subject: Re: John Martyn

Hi Bob…I was so surprised to see you reference John Martyn’s “Head and Heart” as you developed this topic, so had to write. He was a British “folk singer” and quite a trip…talented, fun and outspoken! We were so fortunate to work with and become friends with John during those embryonic beginnings of our band in England in 1970-71. His album, “Bless The Weather” was released at the same time as our 1st album “America” in the U.K., and of course that is the album that included “Head and Heart”. We would hear him sing it often when we did shows with him in those days, and when he sang his voice carried such heart and emotion it could bring tears to your eyes. Like you, this song stayed with us so much that we had to record it ourselves when we returned to the U.S. recorded our second album, “Homecoming”! He had a prolific career making lots of music, and a tragic life in the end but we remember him fondly. Thank you for reminding me of those days. 

best always, Dewey Bunnell

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Subject: Re: John Martyn

Hi Bob,

After seeing the reference to John Martyn, I had to chime in.  I worked at a small label in the early 90’s called, Mesa/Bluemoon.  We released a John Martyn album in 1993 called, No Little Boy.  It was a really great album.  I got to spend some time with John, spoke with him a lot on the phone.  He was funny, friendly, really delightful.  I took him to an interview at KCRW back then.  He did a gig at McCabe’s guitar shop in Santa Monica around that time.  Tiny place, but it was packed to the brim.  Not only was John a legendary songwriter, he was an amazing guitarist.  One of the best of his time.  Sorry we lost him.  Thank you for bringing him to your readers’ attention again!

Bud Harner

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Re: John Martyn

I was John Martyn’s agent in 1975/6.
One of the most extraordinary talents I’ve ever worked with.
When he was clean and sober he was absolute charmer.
When he wasn’t he could be nightmare.
He’s never had the acknowledgement his work deserves.

Richard Griffiths

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Subject: Re: John Martyn

john martyn, ‘solid air’, play what would have been the first side back in 73.  the lyrics are unintelligible, the guitar playing like a fred neil acid trip—-and it will blow your mind.  i wanted to see one of his last shows before he died.  played for 20 people, was in a wheelchair with both legs gone and so drunk he fell out of it.  i couldn’t bear to be part of this freak show—–but that’s rock and roll.

Chris Spector 

Midwest Record

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Subject: Re: Leo Sayer Responds

Hey, Bob. I was at Leo’s original showcase for Warners above a fish and chip restaurant in Brighton, England. We got reacquainted when he supported Foreigner on an Australian cruise a few years ago. He’s right, he’s still got it with great songs, a strong voice, and all his own hair!

Best, Phil Carson

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Subject: Re: Leo Sayer Responds

Love Leo. I did like 5 albums with him back in the day starting in the late 70’s.

A great singer/writer and an even nicer guy!

Luke

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Re: Wolfman Jack

My son, age 21, a self taught  musician, a bit of a savant (high functioning autism), absolutely loves Todd Rundgren. He knows everything about him (and other music icons of many genres). Spotify said he was the second most frequent listener of Todd Rundgren in the whole world in 2019.  Like Todd, he does it all himself.

I’ve been reading you for years. Thank you for staying real.

Marit Sathrum

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Re: Todd & the Wolfman

Your podcast with Todd Rundgren was the best interview I have ever heard with him, and I highly recommend it to your readers who haven’t yet listened.

I was Wolfman Jack’s last Program Director in 1996 for the Liberty Broadcasting Network. We had him on fifty stations.  Early in our relationship, he asked me to join him in his limo to critique an aircheck from the previous week. I expressed my admiration for him and my hesitancy to review tape with a legend. He just laughed and said, “Come on, man….I wanna hear what ya have to say. Everybody can get better, including me!”  I’ve been expressing that simple thought to talent ever since, and while not everyone listens, those who do invariably achieve greater creativity.

“Look me in the eyes baby, now you cut that jive
You know the Wolfman’s just about
The number one cat alive”

Whenever I listen to Todd’s song, I feel like I’m back in that limo with The Wolfman.

Keep up the excellent work, Bob,

Mark Lapidus

Fairfax, Virginia

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Re: Wolfman Jack

Todd has been a good friend for years.

Unique in every way and wonderfully unpredictable.

There is a lesser-known album of his called “Healing”

It is profound from the first note.

Recommend head-phones of you want to be in the  room with him.

Joe Walsh

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From: Tony Hawk

Subject: Re: The Tony Hawk Documentary

Thanks Bob! I was hoping you’d see it because you know the mindset it takes to do this stuff at a high level. I was excited to hear your take and it did not disappoint. We are driven, determined and obsessed – sometimes to a fault – with an activity that was largely misunderstood for decades. And I look forward to returning to it as soon as possible. 

Tony

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From: PORKFOOT and The One Man Boyband

Subject: Re: The Tony Hawk Documentary

I once met Frank Hawk when I as 15 years old. We helped him set up for a skate contest and he took my friend and I to 7/11 for slurpees. We hung out around him all week, and I only found his strictness to be complete dad vibe. You are right. Tony was so lucky to have a father that was so invested in his son’s own interests.

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From: Tony Hawk

Subject: Re: The Tony Hawk Documentary

That sums up my dad; gruff but warm and giving.

Tony

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From: Wendy Waldman

Subject: Re: Mailbag

In Warsaw right now and reminded in a million different ways that many Americans have absolutely no clue. My Polish friends are stepping up to the plate even when their stupid government lags behind. The PEOPLE of Poland are sheltering more than a million refugees themselves. Everyone is helping.

Cause these guys lived under communism- Mietek wasn’t allowed to record until after the wall fell- then he had hits out of the box- he remembers standing in line for cabbage with his grandmother and he speaks excellent Russian which was forced on him— yeah they remember and they hate the Russians. They know how it can be and they’re rallying like they did in Solidarity. The head of one of the big centers downtown personally brought back 70,000 people in his car back and forth to the border.

Everyone is helping in whatever way they can.

As the brilliant and well known here composer bassist Marcin Poszpieszalski said, this is a historic moment.

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Subject: Re: Dann Huff-This Week’s Podcast

Bob, the podcast with Dann Huff was one of the best yet.  No wonder it went almost three hours — could’ve gone for eight!

Such a brilliant guy, but so humble and (comfortably) introspective. Loved the bit about what he had learned from his first co-production stint — for just one example.

Also really fun to hear how the conversation built momentum all the way til the end. Together you guys got to the very core of things.

When he asked you “Bob, how long do you plan on doing this?” it was like a perfect ellipsis had been reached.

Hope he gets U2 as a result of your show with him.  I’d love to hear the result.

Stev Lindstrom

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Subject: Re: Book Recs/Bonnie Raitt

I first heard Bonnie Raitt late one night while attending college. I had just discovered my girlfriend was cheating on me with the big drug dealer on campus.

Call it love, call it infatuation, or maybe it was just the sex but I was in love with that girl some kinda bad. She had long blonde curls and I had a huge fro. This was ‘69/‘70 and our relationship was very much taboo in Virginia.

“Love Has No Pride” made me cry a river. Even listening to it now is like a time trip. So I fell in love with Bonnie (naturally).

I had a friend who ran Whisper Concerts and was fortunate enough to catch whenever she played the DC/Richmond/  Norfolk region. Usually with Little Feat and/or Jackson Browne.

I got to meet her backstage (it was my birthday) and someone tipped her off. She came over and said “Ok Tom, the jig is up” and gave me a peck on the cheek. I almost peed my pants.

And much later when she was was signed to Capitol I mentioned the incident to her and she laughed. I think she was just being polite.

Bonnie is one of those REAL artists. 

Genuine and true. It’s nice to grow old with her music.

Tom Cartwright

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From: Arny Schorr

Subject: RE: The Grammy Ratings

I watched parts of it because my wife wanted to see it but I just couldn’t bring myself to endure the entire show. I was trying to explain to her why it was so horrendous and it came to me…it was over produced (too slick, too busy, too schmaltzy). When announcing the nominees, you couldn’t focus on the artist because there were so many graphics laid over the artist visual and the “in memoriam” was just too busy, too much camera movement, too many distractions from acknowledging those who passed.

And with all due respect, the fact Taylor Hawkins got 90 seconds and Charlie Watts got 3 seconds encapsulates a major problem with the Grammys and the RnR Hall of Fame. The Taylor Hawkins of this world rode in on the path laid down by Charlie Watts, Neal Peart, Keith Moon, Ed Cassidy, Ginger Baker and others of their ilk who’d been around for years and were also cultural icons. 

The Hall of Fame recognizes more current artists while shunning artists who had a massive cultural impact…Steppenwolf, Jethro Tull, Bad Company, King Crimson, New York Dolls, DEVO, Link Wray, Dick Dale all have had an impact musically and culturally but Journey, Def Lepard, ELO, Dells and (solo) Stevie Nicks are in?

Just the whiny ramblings of an old man who views the concept of musical ‘justice’ differently….

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Re: Spotify’s Share

I’m certain that Apple completely dropped the ball re: music by making iTunes a completely unusable piece of orphan software. As a Gen Xer, I tried all sorts of ways to leverage my huge ripped CD library, punctuated by Napster-era stolen music and infrequent MP3 purchases from Amazon and other sources), but it was a complete mess to manage.  I am convinced that “synching” anything is the biggest software lie ever perpetrated.

Despite all its flaws, after my kids hoodwinked me into setting up a famils membership two years ago, Sporify’s been nothing short of transformational.  Now that’s had time to stew, it’s suggesting stuff I’d long forgotten about … especially “Yacht Rock” era gems such as https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMlB0302S50 . After your recent Todd Rundgren piece, I backfilled elements of “Something, Anything” I hadn’t heard in 35 years since college, and now they’re once again part of my daily listening rotation. Magic.

In addition, its usefullness as an incredible podcast organization tool is not to be underestimated (that’s how I listen to you, by the way, including the back catalog).

Sincerely,

Gunnar Miller

Frankfurt, Germany

From: Dan Millen

Re: Spotify’s Share

In the olden days you wanted to sell a revolutionary new widget you needed:

Cash – The widget itself cost $ – cash you need to pay upfront in order to even manufacture the widget and / or to hire the employees to make it and sell it.
You sold it to someone else at 50% off list (not 30% or less which is what apple takes) or you sold it to a distributor sometimes at an even sharper discount.

You pay the shipping, either to the distributor or to retail.

You hired a sales force to knock on doors to get your widget placed into stores even if you go through a distributor, because chances are the distributor isn’t going to go out of their way to push your widget to retail unless it’s a big smash hit.  And you’ve got to give the salespeople incentives, spiffs and bonuses.
You make volume discounts and net terms to retailers (30 day payment saves you 1%)

At the end of the day you’re lucky if you’re making 15% margin on your widgets.

With physical records the artist got screwed even more.

Cost the same for the label to make, but they’ll only pay you mechanicals on up to ten songs.
Maybe you get 10-13 points on your albums after deductions.

Packaging deductions
Breakage deductions

Holdback against returns
Holdback against marketing
If you have a shitty attorney they cross collateralize your mechanicals with your record royalties, and maybe even publishing if they can get their mitts on it.

Nowadays they want a piece of your merch and touring too.

You never recoup, it costs you more than it’s worth to audit, and all you see is publishing.

If you are selling apps as widgets on IPhones you are still making 15-20% more gross margin than if you were shipping the widgets to retailers.

If you are putting music up on Spotify without a label you have a chance of making much more than you’d make on a traditional deal – you just need to be heard.

The level of ignorance around this is stunning, but wilful ignorance and finger pointing is what passes for culture around the world.

Pandemics and wars apparently are not enough to quell the selfishness, entitlement mentality and finger pointing of humanity.

Perhaps next a zombie apocalypse will get humans back to basics?

/end of rant.

Apple is under scrutiny for taking a huge slice of in-app purchases and the belief that it favors its own applications over others. This is a fight that has garnered headlines when it comes to gaming, i.e. the Epic Games (Fortnite) lawsuit, but the heavy lifting is being done by the Europeans.

And thank god for that, but I don’t agree with everything the European Commission proffers. Like the standardized connector. Tech moves at light speed and you don’t want to hold back innovation. Also, the iPhone is much more secure because of Apple’s vetting process, to open the iPhone up to third party app stores is a recipe for disaster.

But what I’m talking about today is music streaming services.

In order to back its position, Apple commissioned a study:

“The Success of Third-Party Apps on the App Store”: https://apple.co/3E8Q5Rw

I got wind of the report via MusicAlly, a newsletter from the U.K. that I get every day. But I haven’t seen reference to it anywhere else. The music press is focused on the minutiae. Who’s going up, who’s going down, the petty wars. Meanwhile, the big stories are ignored. All we hear about Spotify is that artists are starving. I’d beat this dead horse, but no one can convince people otherwise, so I won’t.

But Spotify is not the only music streaming service in the game. Perception is that Apple is a significant rival. But the research says the opposite:

“Focusing on dedicated streaming services (i.e., not including YouTube), Spotify is by far the most popular music streaming service for iPhone users in the US, UK, France, Germany, and Australia and New Zealand, based on listening time. In the US, iPhone users spend more than 50% more time on Spotify than on Apple Music, and more than double the time on Spotify than on Pandora, followed by Musi, YouTube Music, and SoundCloud. In the UK, Germany, and Australia and New Zealand, the gap between the largest player (Spotify) and other streaming services is larger. Across these countries, Apple Music’s share out of the top music streaming apps among iPhone users ranges from 19% in Australia and New Zealand to 29% in Germany. 

In Japan, Apple Music is the most popular, followed by Spotify and regional player LINE MUSIC.”

We’ve been hearing all this b.s. about Apple catching up with Spotify, but just the opposite appears true, Spotify is pulling away from Apple where it counts, in listenership. Furthermore, the report says that Spotify is especially popular amongst the young, who listen most and are most responsible for the breaking of new artists.

Now in truth Amazon is a stealth competitor. But in reality, Spotify is the world’s default streaming music app.

So if more people are listening more…the payment per stream is less. Not that any of these streaming services pay per stream, it’s all a percentage, but people want to translate payment into an old metric, when streaming is a new method of consuming music.

Distribution is king. Far more powerful than content providers. Because if you can’t hear it, it doesn’t exist. And the most people hear it on Spotify, giving the Swedish streaming service the most power in the music business.

So, if you want to be heard, you need to be on Spotify. Same deal if you want to get paid. You can rail against this all you want, but in truth the distributor always has more power than the individual. I could analogize to straight business…it’s very hard for independent companies to get their products in grocery stores unless they align with a distributor. The stores only want to deal with the distributor, for numerous reasons, for payment and accounting if nothing else Furthermore, distributors/manufacturers pay slotting fees, yes, they pay to have their wares on the shelves.

So…

Spotify is a business. And it’s the biggest business in the sphere. It won via a first mover advantage and constant innovation. There’s an illusion that brand names mean everything online, but they don’t. If you don’t continue to innovate, you die. This is how Facebook was superseded by TikTok.

If you’re a music maker, don’t complain about Spotify, use it to your advantage. The rock sphere has been hobbled by constant beating up of Spotify, almost always with false facts spewed by uninformed performers. It’s not that complicated, but I’ve rarely dealt with a successful musician who truly understands. An on demand stream pays more than one from radio, like Pandora, and Spotify has a radio feature too. Also, free tier streams pay less than paid tier streams. And you might say to get rid of the free tier, but it’s the free tier that undermines piracy and also converts listeners to paying customers. Statistics tell us this.

So Spotify won. Apple Music is an also-ran in music streaming.

And Spotify continues to innovate.

Amazon is leveraging its regular consumer goods business to make inroads in not only video, but music. The company’s inroads should be watched, even though they do little self-promotion, they reveal little.

But right now Spotify is where the action is, where the people are listening, where the money is.

These facts were known by insiders, but now they’re public.

You don’t want to complain about Spotify, you want to embrace it.

But I know you still hate it.